Here is part two of the Betfair premium charge discussion that I promised. If you are Betfair trading on the Betfair betting exchange you have probably heard of it.
I’ve tried to create a balanced view of it so you can see it from all angles, but obviously, I’d prefer if it never existed. However, I also discuss why it exists.
This video focuses on the charge itself and how it affects me, but also the type of people that tend to get captured by it.
Lots of people talk about premium charge avoidance, but contrary to popular opinion, a lot of people that have views on the premium charge may not actually pay it. A reasonable number pay the lower rate charge, but have never qualified on ANY of the criteria of the higher rate charge. It’s just seen as a badge of honour, which they shouldn’t wear.
Views are generally negative on the charge, especially the higher rate charges. But it’s much worse for people like me that couldn’t do anything about it. We got really stung!
Search and comment on the forum if you want to learn more or express a view:-
www.betangel.com/forum
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If on your lifetime summary, if gross profit & loss shows £-5,000.00 for instance.
Is that saying that you are in the hole for £5,000 or that you have made £5,000
???
Hi peter. Thanks for all your videos they are a great inspiration,
I do get the premium. However you say that they are paid ones a week, with that in mind do you automatically put money away everyday then trading is over to cover this extra charge ? And or what happens if there for some reason is not enough to cover this charge on ones betfair account ?
Thanks in advance for any feed back from you or from anyone else
Best regards
Michael
Implementing it retrospectively seems like theft. Changing a contractual obligation without agreement and forcing back charges does not seem legal.
Excellent videos Peter. I really enjoy your content and instruction. I use Betfair and am concerned about the premium charge as a system I use is increasing in profitability. My only concern about using Betdaq is that they do not offer starting price on the exchange unlike betfair with their BSP. Any idea why this is missing from Betdaq?
All traders in Denmark and most of Scandinavia are screwed since we only got bf and can't use betdaq any other exchanges
Hi – good video. Are you still happy to share some wisdom with people who (think they) are approaching the higher rate premium charge? – If so I will reach out to you….
What does, "number of markets," even mean? Is the Under 2.5 and Under 3.5 Goals Markets, considered two different markets or are is it considered one "Goals Market." Thanks.
Started watching your videos and straight away never used betfair exchange due to their premium charge, I use Smarkets, betdaq and matchbook which are reasonable. Betfair has a lot of liquidity in the markets but so are other exchanges. Soon enough betfair will start to decline and most likely buy out other competitors and apply same premium charge. So Peter why not build an exchange with your knowledge you could even have a better model. Think about it.
Shades of the old British Government's answer to the stars of the 60's, who were really successful – tax them, tax them! Tax them enough and eventually, they'll say "F*ck this!" and go elsewhere/move abroad………
do you think there are many that are able to read the horse racing markets the same as you Peter?
Hey Peter , one shocking news. Betfair has closed accounts of indian cuStomers like me. I have been using betangel for like 3 years now and suddenly my 40% of yearly income has stopped. Very frustrating
Hi Peter,
In the video you said because of your passed trading style you couldn't avoid the premium charge, l am just starting out using Bet Angel (trading horse races pre race) . Is there anything l can do to stay under the top rate apart from just making £240,000 Profit and then quitting. When you mention number of markets traded is that each week or during the lifetime of the account.
Does'nt affect me coz I'm so Rubbish….lol
Peter set up your own exchange mate – charge a flat 3% to all customers, link it only to Bet angel software and save us all.
Today(Jan 28th) is the last day we can use Betfair in India. Betfair has closed its operations in India from now. What to do.
an option which some people might have and I accidentally fell into.
I started off arbing in 2003 and made large losses on betfair while
taking the same amount plus a little bit more of the bookmakers ,
but you know the story , the bookmakers accounts have all been
restricted or closed.
I now have a a betfair account with huge losses and and have found
a niche making small profits on 65% of races and about the same
losses per race on the other 35% of races.
anyway the point is if you have a losing account then you wont be
paying the premium charge until you have recouped all your loses
plus some profit….
The 60% higher rate is excessively greedy and surely counter productive to their business model. I've heard of people either moving on to other things or exchanges because of this. Not to mention the knock-on effect of putting off potential customers (traders) and less winners = less people interested in using their services.
At the 5% rate, take a trader netting £100k per year as an example; Betfair would be making around £5-10k annually from this person (depending on strike rate). That is a huge amount for any company to be making from one customer every year for providing a relatively simple service on a mass scale. At the current 60% PC rate Betfair would be taking £60k from that customer every year which is crazy just for using their platform.
I know they are business and they know that traders don't have many other places to go. Some sort of structure similar to the UK tax model where you have an allowance up to a certain amount which resets every year would be more reasonable. I would like to see the growth of exchanges and more competition between them but as you've also noticed this has been much slower than expected, probably down to the favourability for companies to keep the bookmaker model due to the larger house edge.
I believe you are a Betfair Shareholder as well if I remember right. So the PC charge would add to Betfair's P&L which increases the share price so you do profit from it in a small way. There should be more than one top exchange by now anyway. What the fuck Betdaq do in their office's all day beats me.
Premium Charge is outrageous. 60% – wow – unbelievable. Especially as when it was applied retrospectively. Unfortunately, I haven't earnt enough money to get near it. I think 30% would be the Maximum even then it would still be expensive. Betfair just doesn't want people, who have the ability too, to just snatching money out of the market. I believe that if they are going to apply 60% commission it should reset every 12 months and people should be allowed to earn £50k per year before that % kicks in.
Betfair just doesn't listen to anybody about anything. That's what happens when Businesses have a Monopoly.
What's your view on Smarkets, do you think it's viable for trading?